Thread: Braid difficulty

Originally Posted by southernfishin

i dont know if i would fish braid on that reel the braids worth more than the reel but if u wanna sell that 7500 shoot me a pm

You've got a point about that. The little old shimano has been great for me over the years, but it's probably not a braid reel, or at least not without some mono backing. Even then I might be pushing my luck.

I'm holding onto the 7500SS for two reasons. 1. sentimental. first reel I personally bought and has been pretty good to me. 2. If I decide to do any bigger type of fishing, I have the reel I need. I took it apart the other day to see how bad the inside looked after being 15 years old and it was perfect inside. I was surprised. Not a grain of sand or any rust.

Originally Posted by the original pier pest

If I'm going to fish braid inshore I'm gonna use straight braid with no mono shock leader unless it an actual leader for the lure. One thing to keep in mind with running straight braid is that it has less drag in the water than mono does. Also you need to make sure that the line isn't stronger than the rod it's being fished on. It is very easy to bust the new graphite rods with braid due to there being no stretch.

Originally Posted by mforbesiii

Interesting. I have a 7' tourney special bass pro rod. med-hvy power, fast action, rated for 6-17lb line. Do you think that would be ok with something like 10 or 15# braid?

If doing a lot of short range precision casting with artificials around structures, I will use this method Jeb mentioned, as you'll have more control on your lure and where it lands--as well as smoother casting.

As for breaking a rod due to braid, that would be more of a failure on the part of the fisherman not understanding how to properly set or use drag, and would only happen realistically if someone is either cranking down unnecessary with much stronger line than needed, or fishing situations where fish are being pulled off structures and letting the fish run isn't an option--in which case stronger gear would be needed anyhow to support the line needed to do that.

Using 10# braid shouldn't lead you into such an issue, and I think it would be a good fit for your 6-17 rated. Personally, I'd suggest you drop down to 5#-8# (PP Spectra) if you're casting artificals and have a blast on that. Otherwise, if you're using live bait or snobbling, then go ahead with 10#-15# range and get that extra strength.

Originally Posted by Viking Guy

If doing a lot of short range precision casting with artificials around structures, I will use this method Jeb mentioned, as you'll have more control on your lure and where it lands--as well as smoother casting.

As for breaking a rod due to braid, that would be more of a failure on the part of the fisherman not understanding how to properly set or use drag, and would only happen realistically if someone is either cranking down unnecessary with much stronger line than needed, or fishing situations where fish are being pulled off structures and letting the fish run isn't an option--in which case stronger gear would be needed anyhow to support the line needed to do that.

Using 10# braid shouldn't lead you into such an issue, and I think it would be a good fit for your 6-17 rated. Personally, I'd suggest you drop down to 5#-8# (PP Spectra) if you're casting artificals and have a blast on that. Otherwise, if you're using live bait or snobbling, then go ahead with 10#-15# range and get that extra strength.

Thanks Viking Guy. I actually had typed a long response to your previous reply on this and I have no idea what happened to it. Regardless, it was very helpful and definitely gave me more clarity around when and if braid would really be that beneficial for me.

Since I have no actual experience with it, I see no reason not to use the Spectra like you suggested. Got to rely on the people that have actually tried different brands and fish enough to know what works and what doesn't. It's how I ended up using Ande back country mono, which I really liked a lot.

You had mentioned pier fishing in your other post and the use of greater mono top shot. I won't be making it over to the pier, but I still think a reasonable amount of top shot is probably the way to go regardless of where I end up. I mostly plan to fish from the beach or in a kayak just beyond the breakers or on the bay side.

I looked at Bass Pro's website and for the life of me, I can't find 8# PP Spectra. I see 5 and 10, but not 8. I think 8 would be the right fit for my 7' rod based on what you've said above.

Also, regarding bass pro, will they be able to spool the mono backing, braid, and then mono top shot? I assume I can use my current Ande Back Country 10# mono for the backing and the top shot.

I can't recall, but PP may only offer their regular braid in 8#. I will check online later tonight for you. If you must choose, definitely get the spectra over the regular and with with 5 or 10.

My advice may be 10#, primarily because casting at the beach may take some extra umph, in which case having top shot to cast off your finger will definitely be helpful.

If you are local to this area, I will gladly spool it up for you if you get the line. Bass Pro will do it, but I might be a little more meticulous on your behalf.

Also keep in mind that your braid rating on the box is not going to be what it is in real life. If you notice on break offs it's always at the connection either on your line to line knot or the knot on your hook. A knot weaken the line strength by a large margin(If I remember correctly its about 30-40%, so your 10# test will actually holds about 6-7#)

And I agree with Viking guy, if your rod breaks its user error. The line rating printed on a rod meant to show the best rated line for castabily, if a rod is rated for 25-40# I dare anyone to lift up 40lb of dead weight to it. And if you look at some of the rods it'll actually show you the best line for it in mono and braid and that should tell you it's rating is for castabilty and not how strong the rod is.

On my offshore setup I usually fish with at least pe5 braid and my rod is rated for pe3 or less, I haven't broke a rod yet. You have to learn how to properly handle a fish once you hook it.

Ok mforbesiii. I checked out my arsenal when I got home.

The 8# I have is regular braid hi vis yellow, and I also have a blue colored pp ice - tec 8#.

PP micro line is also available in 3 and 4 # and I love using it for specks.

If you go with spectra, it will be either 5 or 10. In strength tests, the 5 has proven nearly as strong as the 10 with smaller diameter. You might find you like it better as you could get more in the reel.

Originally Posted by Viking Guy

Ok mforbesiii. I checked out my arsenal when I got home.

The 8# I have is regular braid hi vis yellow, and I also have a blue colored pp ice - tec 8#.

PP micro line is also available in 3 and 4 # and I love using it for specks.

If you go with spectra, it will be either 5 or 10. In strength tests, the 5 has proven nearly as strong as the 10 with smaller diameter. You might find you like it better as you could get more in the reel.

I think i can get the Spectra in 8#. Tackle Warehouse seems to show it as available online but only in moss green and only 150 yards. To get 300 yards you have to bump up to 10#. Funny though. The bass pro website doesn't seem to have the 8# listed.

I don't live in the area, but I appreciate the offer to spool the line for me. I'm in Dallas. I have a basspro near where I work, but I don't know how willing they are to spool mono backing then braid on top. I was hoping to be able to do it on my own if possible. Any tips on spooling mono then braid that i should be using? I've seen videos where people run the braid through a phone book to keep the tension higher. I could probably come up with something similar around my garage if necessary.

Originally Posted by mforbesiii

I think i can get the Spectra in 8#. Tackle Warehouse seems to show it as available online but only in moss green and only 150 yards. To get 300 yards you have to bump up to 10#. Funny though. The bass pro website doesn't seem to have the 8# listed.

I don't live in the area, but I appreciate the offer to spool the line for me. I'm in Dallas. I have a basspro near where I work, but I don't know how willing they are to spool mono backing then braid on top. I was hoping to be able to do it on my own if possible. Any tips on spooling mono then braid that i should be using? I've seen videos where people run the braid through a phone book to keep the tension higher. I could probably come up with something similar around my garage if necessary.

The Spanish Fort BPS does that all the time.
Usually we try to calculate all the line into a formula that is 'size compatible' for mono backing.
For instance 20# braid with 6# (or 8#) mono as backing,
50# braid with 20# mono, etc.

Trouble is many reel manufacturers exaggerate their reel line capacity (Shimano is the worst) and most braid manufacturers under exaggerate their line thickness (PP is the worst).
This ends up with a situation where you still have braid on the spooler but the reel is full.
So the only recourse is to strip it all off and start over again. And I HATE wasting my (and the customer's) time doing that!

So THE best method I've found (with spinning reels) is to tie the braid on the reel spool and run all of it off, THEN tie on the mono backing on and fill the spool to "full capacity".
Then get another spool of the exact same reel and spool the lines onto it, reversing the process.
Works perfectly EVERY time ;-)

Hope this helps!

Originally Posted by Pier#r

The Spanish Fort BPS does that all the time.
Usually we try to calculate all the line into a formula that is 'size compatible' for mono backing.
For instance 20# braid with 6# (or 8#) mono as backing,
50# braid with 20# mono, etc.

Trouble is many reel manufacturers exaggerate their reel line capacity (Shimano is the worst) and most braid manufacturers under exaggerate their line thickness (PP is the worst).
This ends up with a situation where you still have braid on the spooler but the reel is full.
So the only recourse is to strip it all off and start over again. And I HATE wasting my (and the customer's) time doing that!

So THE best method I've found (with spinning reels) is to tie the braid on the reel spool and run all of it off, THEN tie on the mono backing on and fill the spool to "full capacity".
Then get another spool of the exact same reel and spool the lines onto it, reversing the process.
Works perfectly EVERY time ;-)

Hope this helps!

Thanks #r. That helps. I will try the BPS near me and see what they think. I haven't run into a lot of guys at this BPS that do any salt water stuff, so getting advice can be difficult. I would imagine the BPS where you work is A LOT more informed when it comes to the salt water applications and methods.

Your method definitely seems like the way to go. The one thing it got me wondering about was line lay. I know the old reels aren't necessarily designed to lay braid as well as the new, but is that more of an aesthetics thing or will it actually impact functionality.

As you probably read previously, I was looking to spool an old shimano reel with PP Spectra, so I would be getting the worst of both worlds in your example above. Not to mention, it's a 20+ year old reel. I like the idea of getting a new small reel (braid ready or at least designed with braid usage in mind) for the 7' rod and using braid with the mono backing and top shot. But I also was leaning towards replacing my 7500SS on my 10' rod for something in the 5500 size. I love the 7500SS and it's never let me down, but I'd be lying if I said my brother in law's 5500 Battle wasn't easier to fish with. The 7500 just feels too big for what I am trying to catch (reds, specs, pomps, etc.). I run 20# Ande mono on it now, and it works like a champ, but a smaller reel is going to be lighter, cast better, and let me have a bit more fight when I land something. That being said, I'm not sure the budget can afford to replace both the 7500 and the Shimano in the same year.

...what I am trying to catch (reds, specs, pomps, etc.)

All you need is 10# max for these fish (many folks use 6#).
A single 4500 Penn Spinfisher V might just suite all your needs best.
Use the 7500 for tarpon and kings ;-)